Marina Mentzel , CEO and founder of  urSwim , is changing the way families access swim instruction with a business model that brings lessons and lifeguard services directly to their communities. After starting her career in law, Mentzel found her passion in entrepreneurship, launching  urSwim a decade ago and franchising the brand in 2022. Mentzel has spent the past several years shaping urSwim into a franchise system designed to be both accessible for owners and impactful for the communities they serve. Along the way, she has focused on building a model that removes many of the barriers typically associated with traditional brick-and-mortar swim schools. “I fell in love with franchising about a decade ago,” Mentzel said. “Franchising felt like a good blend of my skill sets.” While she entered franchising with confidence in the concept, Mentzel said she quickly realized that growth would require patience and a strong focus on brand awareness and partner alignment. “As an emerging brand, I realized, ‘Wow, I’m just getting started,’” Mentzel said. Built around a dual B2C and B2B model, urSwim provides in-home swim instruction for families while also offering lifeguard staffing and turnkey swim programs for municipalities and large organizations. The structure allows franchisees to serve communities that often lack access to traditional swim schools while entering the category at a lower investment point. “We’re not just providing swim instruction,” Mentzel said. “We are a franchise and a system. And here’s how we’re all going to do better together.” In a  recent episode of the “Franchisor Hot Seat” podcast , Mentzel spoke with 1851 Franchise’s  Nick Powills about her journey, the challenges of growing a franchise and how urSwim is helping fill the gap in swim education for underserved areas. A transcript of Powills’ interview with Mentzel has been provided below. It has been edited for brevity, clarity and style. Nick Powills: Marina first, then urSwim. So, Marina, how did you fall into franchising? What’s your franchise story? Marina Mentzel:  I don’t have an accidental story. I fell in love with franchising about a decade ago. I knew the brand I was launching might be a good fit for franchising. I studied law in a previous life, so I guess I stumbled into it during law school. But I got bit by the entrepreneurial bug, and franchising felt like a good blend of both skill sets. I franchised my business, urSwim, in 2022, after a decade of running the brand, launching it, learning about it and understanding my customers. Then we sold our first franchise last year. Powills: That’s awesome. A few things I want to unpack. You go through the process of franchising your business. You’ve put blood, sweat and tears into building the foundation, and you spend an exhaustive amount of energy getting it ready for that moment. As you went through this process, were you thinking, “I’m going to sell 1,000 of these on day one”? Take me through that mindset. What was your expectation, and how has it played out? Mentzel:  Like most entrepreneurs, I was very optimistic. Through the process of franchising my business, I thought, “If you build it, they will come.” As an emerging brand, I realized, “Wow, I’m just getting started.” That shift in mindset was really valuable. I think a lot of emerging brands go in wide-eyed thinking, “Yes, I’m going to have 100 locations in a year.” It does happen for some brands, but for me, the work was just beginning. It’s an exciting time in our business because we can double down on everything that makes our brand special. It’s also a time to find the right partners who are a great fit for us. Powills: Entrepreneur, lawyer — you’re obviously sophisticated going into this. You went into franchising thinking, “They’re going to find us.” Now, flash forward. You’ve built a good business opportunity. Is it an awareness challenge right now? Is it the category? There’s not a swim solution on every corner in America like a burger brand. What is the next hurdle? Mentzel:  We’ve done a great job creating a brand locally. Brand awareness is probably our first challenge — figuring out where we want to grow strategically as a brand and how to get the word out. We’re not just providing swim instruction, at-home swim instruction and staffing lifeguards, but we are a franchise and a system — and here’s how we’re all going to do better together. So, yes, brand awareness is definitely one of our challenges. Our category is hot — we’re in children’s enrichment. There aren’t many competitors in the space when it comes to non-brick-and-mortar swim instruction franchises. We’re excited because we believe our brand has a competitive advantage with our two verticals. We offer a B2C swim instruction model, and we also provide a B2B model where we offer lifeguards and turnkey swim programs for larger clients. Powills: I’m going to make a statement, because this is what I do. When I hear something, I think, “OK, let’s take the big-box swim schools.” Take the biggest argument — Goldfish Swim School. Goldfish has plenty of people coming to the table saying, “I want to own a swim school.” Some of those people get rejected because the market is already sold out. That’s where a lot of leads come from. But some of them are not qualified financially. If I think about where the next wave of franchise brokering is headed, it’s going to involve a collective of franchisors educating people on what franchising actually is. I think that’s the biggest hurdle. Like we talked about in the meeting you had yesterday, people don’t know what franchising is. Beyond that, it’s about aligning someone with the right brand. We talked offline about this, but it’s also about the money. That’s why franchise brokers exist — to help facilitate that relationship and exchange. So in the future, why wouldn’t Goldfish say, “Hey, Marina, we could be your franchise broker. Let us connect you with the lower financially qualified leads that could step into your business and grow”? Am I crazy for thinking that? Mentzel:  No. I love it as a strategy. It’s not something I’ve pursued, but if Goldfish is listening and they think there’s an opportunity, I’m always happy to have a conversation. The big difference between us and the big-box swim schools is that we’re non-brick-and-mortar. That means our franchisees come in at a much lower price point. Our all-in investment is about $100,000, which includes a turnkey swim program and the franchise fee. We help facilitate everything — leases, licenses and getting our franchisees set up with some of our national partners to place our turnkey swim programs. With a big-box swim school, you’re looking at an 18-month to two- or three-year build-out. It’s a completely different type of franchisee. That said, the opportunity is tremendous for both non-brick-and-mortar and brick-and-mortar models. Here’s why: Drowning is the leading cause of death for children under the age of 4. Over the past decade, there’s been a massive increase in residential swimming pools, which puts more pressure on households to ensure their children know how to swim — whether that’s through a big-box school or through services like ours. We provide swim instruction in our clients’ own backyards, making the education accessible in a different way. The need is huge, and there’s plenty of opportunity in this space. Another thing that sets us apart from big-box swim schools is our ability to penetrate areas they might not see as viable investments. We can target communities that are swim school deserts, where there isn’t a swim school within 10, 15 or even 20 miles. One of my goals in starting this brand is not just to help franchisees achieve financial success and enjoy the lifestyle I’ve been so blessed to have, but also to create impact. We want to drive meaningful change in these communities. For example, many people are surprised when I tell them drowning is the leading cause of death for young children. Raising awareness and helping keep our communities safe is incredibly important to me. Powills: I love all that. The reality is, in the segment you’re in, a big-box swim school and your model complement each other. In franchising, there’s often this fear of competition, but the truth is, you’re not a competitor — you’re an extension. Because you can go into markets where big-box schools can’t find the real estate to support their model, it feels more like a connection than competition. Then I think about other complementary opportunities, like pool service franchises — not mom-and-pop operations, but established franchises. If you’re a new franchisee in the market, you’d want to build relationships with pool service providers. They’re already servicing the pools, and I’m sure they get questions from homeowners about how to add safety when they have children. It’s a great referral source. And if I’m a pool service franchisee with an existing customer database, why wouldn’t I consider adding this to my portfolio? It’s not competitive; it enhances the relationship with the homeowner. Mentzel:  Exactly. We’re adjacent to them, not competing with them. We’re enhancing one of their services. Those customers want to keep their pools safe, and we provide a way to accomplish that. Here locally, and as part of our marketing strategy, we coach our franchisees on how to curate and build those relationships. We teach them how to connect with local pool service providers, pool construction companies and property managers to create mutually beneficial partnerships using our services. Powills: Let’s talk about the brand. When you started this 10 years ago, how far ahead was your vision for the problems you were solving? Or were you just faking it until you made it? Mentzel:  There’s always a little bit of “fake it till you make it,” but I definitely had a very clear vision, even by year three and year five. I’ve always envisioned the brand expanding this way. Looking out to the next five years, I’m excited about the brand. I’m bullish on the overall opportunity. There’s such a need for education in this space. A little bit about the industry: There are significant gaps in many communities, and parents are struggling to get their children into local swim schools. With a business model like ours, we can penetrate those underserved markets and meet our customers’ needs. For example, here in New York, we’ve built relationships and contracts with local municipalities. They’ve come to us saying, “You’re the expert in swim education and aquatics. Can you provide these services for our community?” And we’ve seen tremendous success with that. It’s not just about the swim school and the year-round swim model, though that’s a big part of what we do. It’s also about meeting local communities where they are and addressing their specific needs. Powills: I love how you’ve structured this. Out of curiosity, since we’re talking about children’s education, swim lessons and lifeguard placement, how do you account for the fact that some customers will age out of your services? You’ve layered in additional offerings that the community needs. How does that break down in percentages? What does the customer mix look like? Mentzel:  For us at corporate, it’s about a 50/50 split. The beauty of our model is that, depending on your geographic location, you can adjust the levers based on your community’s needs. For us, it’s roughly 50/50, but it’s flexible. What’s really exciting is that we’ve been in business long enough now that some of our former swimmers are now our employees, which is a nice full-circle benefit of the system. When kids age out of our programs, we also offer adult programs. We’ve been intentional about creating inclusive offerings. Only about a third of adults have any kind of water competency, so addressing that gap was one of our goals when we framed the brand and marketing efforts. To circle back to the B2C versus B2B split, one of our biggest strengths is training and acquiring talent. Our different verticals — B2C swim instruction and B2B lifeguard services — allow us to provide diverse opportunities for employees. We can transition staff between verticals and are constantly curating a strong talent pool. This flexibility is something we’ve achieved in a way that I don’t think many of our competitors can match. Powills: Let’s get into the investment. What does it cost? What’s in Item 19? Mentzel: Our Item 19 includes all the basics: working capital, launch costs, the franchise fee — though not all your working capital, just three months of it — and supplies. It covers the nuts and bolts you need to operate and get to day one. Your all-in investment ranges from $88,000 to $106,000, which includes the $45,000 franchise fee. Powills: In Item 19, do you include gross profit or similar metrics? Mentzel:  Absolutely. Our highest-grossing corporate location makes a little over $1 million annually. I believe that’s what’s currently disclosed in Item 19. In the next iteration of our FDD, we’ll include performance numbers for our first franchise’s year one. Powills: And how many locations are considered corporate currently? Mentzel:  For us, corporate includes about six territories. Powills: Now, as a secondary question, let’s strip out franchising for a moment. How many hours a week are you personally putting into managing those six territories? Mentzel:  Me personally? At this point, my primary focus is building the brand, so I wear the franchisor hat full time. I’m more involved once the summer gets underway — that’s an all-hands-on-deck season. During that time, I participate in a lot of client relations efforts, but day-to-day management is handled by my team. I’m lucky to have an amazing team that manages our locations in New York and Connecticut. Their support has been key to our success. Powills: I think that’s an important part of this puzzle. When breaking down the opportunity, I hear that you’ve engineered something that’s low-cost. Within those numbers, you’ve accounted for operating capital, which could be a whole separate discussion, but it’s included. You’ve scaled this to six locations. So, for argument’s sake, if we estimate a $600,000 investment to get six units open, that’s a simple calculation. But what’s notable is that you’ve built a volume that’s still healthy and, more importantly, you’ve removed yourself from the day-to-day operations. For a franchisee, the goal is to be ingrained in their community on day one. But to scale across multiple states or regions, they’ll need to follow a blueprint to extract themselves from the operations of units one, two and three and continue building. Eventually, they could manage a portfolio that’s run by a team, much like you’ve done. You’re the example of what a franchisee could aspire to. Of course, some might prefer to stay focused on a single unit and have a strong impact on their community, and that’s a great option, too. But it’s important to highlight your journey — how you’ve worked hard to extract yourself from the business and shift your focus to working on the business instead of in it. That’s a beautiful part of the story. Mentzel:  Exactly. That’s our goal: to provide the playbook. With the franchisee’s effort, that’s the trajectory — if that’s what they want. My job is to meet franchisees where they are. I want them to be active in their community and able to manage staff. Those are the key skills I’m looking for when having conversations with prospective franchisees. Ultimately, yes, this can replace their income if they’re transitioning from a corporate job. Powills: Let’s talk about the vision. I’m sure you’re a little impatient — thinking, “Let’s get this thing going. I’ve engineered a good business; now let’s get franchisees knocking on my door.” What does the next year look like? What does success mean to you? Mentzel:  For me, this next year is about laying out a systemized strategy for growth. As an emerging brand, we’ve talked before about the tendency to want to scale quickly — that “ants in your pants” feeling to get out to market. But for us, we want to be intentional about who we bring on as partners. Yes, we want to sell locations and award territories, but it’s about doing so thoughtfully. Success for 2025 would look like adding one to three new locations. Our vision for year five is more ambitious — we want to start slow but ramp up quickly after that. Powills: For your first franchisee, how many units did they purchase? Mentzel:  They purchased one. Powills: And you’re comfortable with that? Mentzel:  Yes. Powills: If I’m thinking through this — unsolicited advice — I’m not a fan of three-packs. The issue with them is that they’re often a way for the broker community to inflate the franchise fee to get paid more. So if you’re using a broker network, I wouldn’t advise it. But when I think about properly capitalizing a franchisee, my advice is for them to position themselves in a way where they could eventually feel comfortable owning three units. That means having enough capital to open the first unit, enough for a rainy day and enough for future scaling. If you don’t go in with that level of preparedness, you’ll end up relying more on grit and hustle than on financial resources, which is a much harder path. When I look at a candidate, even if they’re just buying one unit, I’d recommend they qualify themselves as if they were opening three. Marina, you’re the ideal example of what I’d want to replicate. How do I duplicate what you’ve done corporately? For someone listening, they might say, “That’s a $300,000 investment.” And I’d respond, “Yes, but that’s the right way to approach this so you’re properly capitalized to make the right things happen.” Mentzel:  That’s a great point. When you’re looking at any brand or launching a business, being properly capitalized makes a huge difference. It allows you to make decisions with confidence. If you’re not properly capitalized, that’s when decision-making can falter, and we want our franchisees to be prepared. We qualify them thoroughly, but I agree with your point. One of the things that’s unique about our brand is that we generate the majority of our income — about 80% — within a 16-week period. That’s largely due to our geography since we’re based out of New York. For our growth strategy, we’re optimistic about expanding into areas with a 30-week operational footprint. It’s exciting to think about those metrics and see how they perform. Right now, we’re based in the tri-state area and have a great business here, but I’m looking forward to seeing franchisees excel in some of these warmer-weather regions. Powills: When I lived in Atlanta — and I apologize to any environmentalists watching this — I kept my pool at 90 degrees all winter because I needed to use it. Mentzel:  Exactly. Powills: I was your target customer. Mentzel:  You were. Definitely. Powills: Marina, I overuse this statement, but I truly mean it: Franchise buyers bet on the jockey, not the horse. Clearly, you have a personality and business acumen that’s worth following. You’ve worked hard to engineer something great. If I were a buyer, it wouldn’t even matter what you were selling — even if it were pens — I’d still be interested in learning how you built this business. The way you’ve positioned yourself is impressive, and I’m confident you’ll achieve the goals you’ve set. You just need a little more momentum on the franchise growth side, and things will take off. Mentzel:  I’m looking forward to it. Powills: Let’s get it going. Marina, I’m Nick, and that’s another “Franchisor Hot Seat.” Mentzel:  Thanks for having me. Watch the full interview above or on  YouTube .